Revival of Pokemon Online 2

General Rules and Clauses:

- Double elimination.

- All sets are Best of 3. For Grand Finals, the winner of Losers' Finals must win 2 sets, while the winner of Winners' Finals only has to win one. Team changing during a set is allowed.

- BE SURE TO SAVE YOUR LOGS AND SEND THEM TO ME! I will be uploading tournament battles on my YouTube account, which is: www.youtube.com/user/HitoshirezuJamal

- ALL UNRELEASED DREAM WORLD POKEMON ARE BANNED! For a complete list of currently released Dream World Pokemon, see this thread: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3454925

- Species Clause: The use of more than one of the same Pokémon is forbidden. Pokémon that evolve from the same Pokémon but are not an evolution of each other are exempted. For example, the use of Gorebyss and Huntail is allowed, but the use of Gorebyss and Gorebyss or Clamperl and Clamperl in one team is not. If the Pokémon has many different formes that are very different from each other, such as Wormadam or Rotom, they are still limited by species clause as they share the same Pokédex number (and are thus still of the same Pokémon species).

- Sleep Clause: You lose if, at the end of your turn, two of your opponent's Pokemon were put to sleep by a move you used but were not forced into, and neither have had their sleep removed since then.

The clause basically means that if you have already put a Pokemon on your opponent's side to sleep and it is still sleeping, you can't put another one to sleep.
A move you were "forced into" is a move you must use because all other moves (that cannot inflict sleep) are disabled (by Choice item, Encore, or some combination of Taunt, Disable, Torment, and lack of PP) and you cannot switch (due to trapping moves, trapping abilities, Ingrain, or having all other pokemon be fainted).
A move you used includes moves called by Metronome, Sleep Talk, Assist, Me First, or Copycat. It does not include Magic Coat or Magic Bounce.
Rest, used by either player, is never counted by this clause. The ability Effect Spore is also exempted.

- Evasion Clause: The use of evasion boosting moves like Double Team or Minimize, or hold items like Brightpowder or Lax Incense, is forbidden. Similar moves which instead decrease the opposing Pokémon's accuracy, such as Sand-Attack, Mud-Slap, Mirror Shot and Mud Bomb, are allowed. Acupressure, Metronome, and the abilities Sand Veil and Snow Cloak can increase the user's evasion, but still does not fall under this clause.

- OHKO Clause: A Pokemon may not have the moves Fissure, Guillotine, Horn Drill, or Sheer Cold in its moveset.

- WiFi Battle: WiFi Battle MUST BE ON at all times.

Ban List:

Items
All items that increase Evasion (BrightPowder, Lax Incense)

Moves
All moves that increase Evasion only (Double Team, Minimize)
All instant OHKO moves (Fissure, Guillotine, Horn Drill, Sheer Cold)

Abilities
Moody
Drizzle + Swift Swim on the same team

Species
All Unreleased Dream World Pokemon
Arceus-Bug
Arceus-Dark
Arceus-Dragon
Arceus-Electric
Arceus-Fighting
Arceus-Fire
Arceus-Flying
Arceus-Ghost
Arceus-Grass
Arceus-Ground
Arceus-Ice
Arceus-Normal
Arceus-Poison
Arceus-Psychic
Arceus-Rock
Arceus-Steel
Arceus-Water
Blaziken
Darkrai
Deoxys
Deoxys-A
Deoxys-S
Dialga
Excadrill
Garchomp
Giratina
Giratina-O
Groudon
Ho-Oh
Kyogre
Latias w/ Soul Dew
Latios w/ Soul Dew
Lugia
Manaphy
Mewtwo
Palkia
Rayquaza
Reshiram
Shaymin-S
Thundurus
Zekrom

SIGN-UP PAGE: http://challonge.com/tournaments/signup/ei8pvu7jgw

You MUST sign up if you want to be in the bracket.

If I'm able to enter, I'm going to raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaape! ;D

I've decided to quit hosting tournaments after the failure of this one. I was wrong on all accounts, and people won't have to see another of these flops again.

Look, you don't have to stop hosting tourneys.

Yes, there have been some problems with this one, but, honestly, a lot of those are because of things like Super Bowl parties, and the event itself.

You made the decisions you thought were the best, and, while they may have had problems for a couple of losers, your hands were kind of tied on this one.

Trust me, if we try a tourney next week, the only thing that could potentially get in the way is school, and people have already worked around that.

I agree with Ty. IF you do choose to a host a tourney this weekend though as Ty recommended, you should make the tourney thread ASAP and let everyone on MSN know that you can. I think the 6 person turnout wasn't just cause of the Super Bowl, but also a result of it being a one day notice tourney.

Let's get 10+ people at the next tourney!

Dang I was late, this happens when you lose access to a computer....

I like the idea of Jamal not hosting anymore tournaments.

I'll host them if Jamal doesn't then. I won't let Pokemon die in the Pokemon Hacker Community. XD

I do hope Jamal isn't as upset anymore as he was last night though. I did have to be open about my opinions on the tourney though. I don't want him to quit being a TO, I didn't just call him out, out of salt, I did try to help him as a TO too.

You can host them, you aren't a hacker anyways, so it's not like these tournaments stop you from doing anything productive. Also Pokemon won't die in our community just because there wouldn't be tournaments, that's retarded.

I'm not a hacker? BEDUH!

I hack slowly but surely. I've been quiet now instead of like in 2011 when I gave people guarunteed dates. I worked a little bit on episode 7 of my hack a few days in December in January, but not enough to complete it. Plus I'm also going to re-work episodes 1-6 before re-uploading them and continuing episode 7 because I'm unsatisfied with how my early episodes are.

Saying I'm not a hacker is like saying Sarah isn't a hacker. We both have 6 episodes, but are inactive. XD

Anyway, this is getting way off-topic. ^^;

Ya stop getting off topic, just wanted to ask now, are anyone of the hackers allowed to start up there own tourneys? (Gotta hack [getting off topic])

Anyone's allowed to, just as long as they confirm a date and it's fine with everyone else. Jamal and I are the only people in the community who know how to seed a bracket, which is why we're the only ones who host them. Jamal's closer with most of the community than me though, which is why he hosts them more than me. XD

But yeah, anyone can host one. Although I don't think you should make a thread until we know if there is going to be one this weekend or not to make up for how the Super Bowl ruined the schedule of the last one. I know Jamal was really sick yesterday which is probably why he wasn't on today, so let's wait until he comes online until we make any decisions.

Umm....Alright...Dang I didn't know what happened yesterday since we watched the super bowl..Urgh I'm changing the subject....Are you guys rescheduling the tournament? (goes on PO Online's download link)

I'm going to say what I know based on the knowledge I know since I wasn't there on Saturday, I don't know exactly what happened then. Basically what happened is that the tourney was scheduled to be on Saturday which is when it started. The bracket was going fine (I assume?) until Winner's Semis where Tyson and Seth were tied 1-1 (from what Jamal told me) but Seth had to leave and Tyson asked Jamal if they could finish the set on Sunday which he agreed to.

Another interesting thing happened in bracket that day too though, Jamal had lost to Ty in Winner's which some may have expected to happen, but then he lost to Brandon in his very first loser's bracket match, so he was double eliminated then and got last. Since Seth had to leave, that's all that could happen for Saturday, so that's when the tourney stopped for the day.

Now as for Sunday... And this is where the biggest controversy happened. So Seth and Tyson were online and as they started game 3, Seth said "I have to leave." I believe, so Jamal assumed he wouldn't be back as he interpretted that as a "G2G" so he automatically sent Seth to loser's. I myself feel this was a bad decision for two reasons

1. Since Brandon wasn't on, the loser's bracket wouldn't advance much anyway and loser's has more matches than winner's. The only match that would be played after the Tyson vs Seth set is the winner of them vs Ty which would be Winner's Finals, one of the final last 3 sets (or 4 assuming GFs goes to a second set), so it wouldn't hold up the tournament anyway since Brandon wasn't online.

2. Seth randomly does up and go online/offline a lot, anyone who knows Seth on MSN knows that he does this. Although I can see why Jamal interpretted what he said as a G2G, so I'm not blaming Jamal entirely but I noticed he had Ty and Tyson play WFs immediately after that happened, so I do feel Jamal should've at least gave Seth some benefit of the doubt and waited for awhile longer than he did.

Reason 2 is understandable though, because as I said earlier, Jamal was really sick yesterday and he told me he was lying down a lot, so I can understand why he wanted to run the matches as fast as he could so he wouldn't have to be on the computer managing the tournament all day. I still disagree with the decision Jamal made though because of the first reason I listed.

Now I was Appearing Offline most of yesterday, so I wasn't talking to people that much, although I did check the bracket and when I saw Jamal was back in and that he eliminated Seth (after Seth had beat Raina), I was like "WTF?!". I had no idea what had happened so I asked Jamal about it.

He told me that Brandon had come on later that day and that Brandon didn't want to play anymore so he was giving his spot away. Jamal told me that he tried to give it to Pro, but he was busy so he couldn't take it and he would've given it to me if I wasn't Appearing Offline yesterday. So Jamal was the only person left who was willing to take the spot, so he did.

The problem I had with this was.

1. I feel if Brandon didn't want to play anymore, it should've been a forfeit. He's forfeitted in the past and already had a win (he beat Jamal), so anyone who took the spot would have an advantageous spot in the bracket they didn't even work to get. I know I wouldn't have taken the spot even if I was Appearing Online, the reason I wanted Raina's spot (for those of you who don't know, I did want her spot since I couldn't show up on Saturday due to a Brawl tourney) was because she was already in loser's first round and hadn't beat anyone. So even if I took the spot, there'd be no bracket advantage for me in any way.

2. Jamal himself had already been double eliminated from the tourney, by Ty in Winner's and Brandon in Loser's. This maybe just IMO, but I feel it was unfair for him to be able to get back in the tournament after he had already been eliminated. I'm sure a lot of people thought of him as a threat considering he's second on our current Power Rankings and may have been relieved on Saturday when he was double eliminated early meaning he wouldn't be a threat to them. And then on Sunday he gets back in... IMO this was unfair to the rest of the people who were still in the tournament and thought they didn't have to see Jamal as a tournament threat anymore.

So as for the final bit of controversy that happened... As I mentioned earlier, Jamal had beaten Seth in loser's after he was already double eliminated. This was extremely controversal because I, Seth and some others feel this was incredibly unfair to Seth. He got a forced forfeit in Winner's and then had to battle someone who he shouldn't have had to worry about anymore as they were already eliminated. When I found out this happened, I basically called out Jamal on it and told him that this tourney was a flop. I assume he showed others our discussion cause later in the discussion, he posted chatlogs of what they were saying meaning for them to have known, he had to show them what we were discussing. In the end, everyone did agree that the tournament was a flop.

I don't blame Jamal, him being sick along with it being Super Bowl weekend made this tournament very hard for him to manage. If I remember correctly, Brandon gave up his spot because of a Super Bowl party and the Super Bowl was also the reason Seth was coming online and offline so inconsistently.

This tournament WAS a flop, but Jamal is a good TO and I believe if not for the circumstances of last weekend, this tournament would have run fine.

Remember, everything I said is from my point of view and what I was told/saw. I didn't enter the tournament myself because I was at a Brawl tournament on Saturday which is when the tournament started, although I was keeping up to date on the bracket as I checked the bracket image every few hours.

So SSM (and any others who may not know), if you're curious, this is what happened from my point of view.

Jamal, when you read this, you may add in any other words you'd like to say and let us know if you do want to host a tourney this weekend (a tourney with more than a one day notice would be good for turnouts ^^; ). You're a good TO and I don't think you should quit, but mixed with the one day notice, it being Super Bowl weekend and you getting sick, I honestly can't blame you for what happened and no one else should either. All anyone can really say is that... It did happen, this tournament did flop but it can't be blamed on a single person. Jamal told me this tournament wouldn't count towards PR, so the next time there's a PO tourney, I think we should talk with the interest list to find times/dates that work with the majority's schedule so everyone has a fair chance to do well and get ranked next time!

Guys once again, I'd please like to stress, don't blame Jamal for this, he didn't know it was Super Bowl weekend and honestly, I didn't know either so even if it was me who tried to host a tourney last weekend, it probably would've flopped too. It was just a bad weekend to have a tournament on.

That's all I have to say, I hope everyone can forgive Jamal as I have and look forward to the next PO tourney being one to remember! ;D

-Poyo

I was there during the controversy happened, so I'm going to shed some light on the matter.

The tourney started on Saturday, and that was where I got to WFs, Seth and Tyson were Winner's Semis, and the lone Loser match happened.

Tyson and Seth were playing their set, and got to game 3 when the shenanigans happened. Seth had to leave constantly, and, the few times he was on, Tyson had to get off because of his mother. This caused the match to be postponed until Sunday (yesterday).

Now, for that, Seth did leave because he had to do yardwork. However, he was gone for quite a bit, and Tyson and I did want to continue since we never knew when he would be back.

So, with that in mind, Jamal made the only decision to keep the tourney going.

Now, as for Jamal getting back in. Honestly, that was something we had no control over. Pro couldn't make it, and everyone else was unable to as well (excluding Tim, but he was recording stuff for his LPs).

Now, while Brandon could have been given a forfeit, think of it this way, that would have put either Raina, Seth, Tyson, or myself. in a very advantageous spot since they basically escalate to Loser's Finals, which was only a step away from Grand Finals. So either way, someone would've been in a very good position in the tourney.

Now, as for the the tourney, we're heavily considering redoing the whole thing this weekend. Sadly, Raina and Sakura won't be able to make it, so we do lose out on two competitors. If we can generate interest, however, that won't be as much as a problem.

That is all I have to say, ATM.

~Your friendly neighborhood Super Mod, Ty.

Yeah, I'm still sick, but I have quite a few things to say:

Poyo wrote:I agree with Ty. IF you do choose to a host a tourney this weekend though as Ty recommended, you should make the tourney thread ASAP and let everyone on MSN know that you can. I think the 6 person turnout wasn't just cause of the Super Bowl, but also a result of it being a one day notice tourney.

Let's get 10+ people at the next tourney!

I was given the suggestion of hosting one within a one-day notice.

KingDakota wrote:I like the idea of Jamal not hosting anymore tournaments.

That's just rubbing salt in the wound. It's not like I even host tournaments on a regular basis anymore, either. This post was entirely unnecessary.

Poyo wrote:I'll host them if Jamal doesn't then. I won't let Pokemon die in the Pokemon Hacker Community. XD

I do hope Jamal isn't as upset anymore as he was last night though. I did have to be open about my opinions on the tourney though. I don't want him to quit being a TO, I didn't just call him out, out of salt, I did try to help him as a TO too.

The Callout: From what I gathered, you were much more pissed about me reprimanding you for trying to take Raina's spot in the tournament, as well as Seth not being able to win the tournament (or in your terms, "getting dicked over") than you were about how poorly the tournament was run. You admitted it yourself that part of the reason you "called me out" was because of Seth. You stated that I was like poison to Seth, and that it "might have been satisfying for him to see me double eliminated"... yeah, how is that NOT implying bias?

As for the Raina situation, there was not even a small bit of indication beforehand that Raina would not be able to make it online on Sunday (and indeed, she was able to make it online) before you asked me if you could take her spot in the tournament.

Poyo wrote:I'm going to say what I know based on the knowledge I know since I wasn't there on Saturday, I don't know exactly what happened then. Basically what happened is that the tourney was scheduled to be on Saturday which is when it started. The bracket was going fine (I assume?) until Winner's Semis where Tyson and Seth were tied 1-1 (from what Jamal told me) but Seth had to leave and Tyson asked Jamal if they could finish the set on Sunday which he agreed to.

Another interesting thing happened in bracket that day too though, Jamal had lost to Ty in Winner's which some may have expected to happen, but then he lost to Brandon in his very first loser's bracket match, so he was double eliminated then and got last. Since Seth had to leave, that's all that could happen for Saturday, so that's when the tourney stopped for the day.

Now as for Sunday... And this is where the biggest controversy happened. So Seth and Tyson were online and as they started game 3, Seth said "I have to leave." I believe, so Jamal assumed he wouldn't be back as he interpretted that as a "G2G" so he automatically sent Seth to loser's. I myself feel this was a bad decision for two reasons

1. Since Brandon wasn't on, the loser's bracket wouldn't advance much anyway and loser's has more matches than winner's. The only match that would be played after the Tyson vs Seth set is the winner of them vs Ty which would be Winner's Finals, one of the final last 3 sets (or 4 assuming GFs goes to a second set), so it wouldn't hold up the tournament anyway since Brandon wasn't online.

2. Seth randomly does up and go online/offline a lot, anyone who knows Seth on MSN knows that he does this. Although I can see why Jamal interpretted what he said as a G2G, so I'm not blaming Jamal entirely but I noticed he had Ty and Tyson play WFs immediately after that happened, so I do feel Jamal should've at least gave Seth some benefit of the doubt and waited for awhile longer than he did.

Reason 2 is understandable though, because as I said earlier, Jamal was really sick yesterday and he told me he was lying down a lot, so I can understand why he wanted to run the matches as fast as he could so he wouldn't have to be on the computer managing the tournament all day. I still disagree with the decision Jamal made though because of the first reason I listed.

Now I was Appearing Offline most of yesterday, so I wasn't talking to people that much, although I did check the bracket and when I saw Jamal was back in and that he eliminated Seth (after Seth had beat Raina), I was like "WTF?!". I had no idea what had happened so I asked Jamal about it.

He told me that Brandon had come on later that day and that Brandon didn't want to play anymore so he was giving his spot away. Jamal told me that he tried to give it to Pro, but he was busy so he couldn't take it and he would've given it to me if I wasn't Appearing Offline yesterday. So Jamal was the only person left who was willing to take the spot, so he did.

The problem I had with this was.

1. I feel if Brandon didn't want to play anymore, it should've been a forfeit. He's forfeitted in the past and already had a win (he beat Jamal), so anyone who took the spot would have an advantageous spot in the bracket they didn't even work to get. I know I wouldn't have taken the spot even if I was Appearing Online, the reason I wanted Raina's spot (for those of you who don't know, I did want her spot since I couldn't show up on Saturday due to a Brawl tourney) was because she was already in loser's first round and hadn't beat anyone. So even if I took the spot, there'd be no bracket advantage for me in any way.

2. Jamal himself had already been double eliminated from the tourney, by Ty in Winner's and Brandon in Loser's. This maybe just IMO, but I feel it was unfair for him to be able to get back in the tournament after he had already been eliminated. I'm sure a lot of people thought of him as a threat considering he's second on our current Power Rankings and may have been relieved on Saturday when he was double eliminated early meaning he wouldn't be a threat to them. And then on Sunday he gets back in... IMO this was unfair to the rest of the people who were still in the tournament and thought they didn't have to see Jamal as a tournament threat anymore.

So as for the final bit of controversy that happened... As I mentioned earlier, Jamal had beaten Seth in loser's after he was already double eliminated. This was extremely controversal because I, Seth and some others feel this was incredibly unfair to Seth. He got a forced forfeit in Winner's and then had to battle someone who he shouldn't have had to worry about anymore as they were already eliminated. When I found out this happened, I basically called out Jamal on it and told him that this tourney was a flop. I assume he showed others our discussion cause later in the discussion, he posted chatlogs of what they were saying meaning for them to have known, he had to show them what we were discussing. In the end, everyone did agree that the tournament was a flop.

I don't blame Jamal, him being sick along with it being Super Bowl weekend made this tournament very hard for him to manage. If I remember correctly, Brandon gave up his spot because of a Super Bowl party and the Super Bowl was also the reason Seth was coming online and offline so inconsistently.

This tournament WAS a flop, but Jamal is a good TO and I believe if not for the circumstances of last weekend, this tournament would have run fine.

Remember, everything I said is from my point of view and what I was told/saw. I didn't enter the tournament myself because I was at a Brawl tournament on Saturday which is when the tournament started, although I was keeping up to date on the bracket as I checked the bracket image every few hours.

So SSM (and any others who may not know), if you're curious, this is what happened from my point of view.

Jamal, when you read this, you may add in any other words you'd like to say and let us know if you do want to host a tourney this weekend (a tourney with more than a one day notice would be good for turnouts ^^; ). You're a good TO and I don't think you should quit, but mixed with the one day notice, it being Super Bowl weekend and you getting sick, I honestly can't blame you for what happened and no one else should either. All anyone can really say is that... It did happen, this tournament did flop but it can't be blamed on a single person. Jamal told me this tournament wouldn't count towards PR, so the next time there's a PO tourney, I think we should talk with the interest list to find times/dates that work with the majority's schedule so everyone has a fair chance to do well and get ranked next time!

Guys once again, I'd please like to stress, don't blame Jamal for this, he didn't know it was Super Bowl weekend and honestly, I didn't know either so even if it was me who tried to host a tourney last weekend, it probably would've flopped too. It was just a bad weekend to have a tournament on.

That's all I have to say, I hope everyone can forgive Jamal as I have and look forward to the next PO tourney being one to remember! ;D

-Poyo

I've covered most of the things I wanted to say up above, although I'd like to state that I don't really have a TO-mindset after this tournament. Coupled with me currently being sick, I can't guarantee myself hosting a tournament this weekend, or ever again for that matter. Despite me being far less upset about the whole situation now, I'm really devastated by people "calling me out" and making an overall bigger deal about the whole thing than it should have been. These tournaments were always for fun and getting your competitive spirit out, and not a petty, empty excuse to prove that you're the best at "beating others in Pokemanz." The PR was a fun little experiment as well, but people went and took it way too seriously. Okay, you're not considered "the best" because you're not ranked 1st, but should you really give a damn?

While I admit that this was not the best tournament I hosted (and certainly not one I want to go out with), I think people need to really rethink this whole thing out. Seeing people get completely upset about their PR rankings, placings in tournaments, and being entirely SALTY about who they lost to just really puts a dent in the whole competitive scene I was setting up.

If this DOES happen to be the last tournament I've hosted, I'd like to personally thank Ty for sticking up for me and assessing the true nature of the situation of this tournament. I'd also like to thank Tyson, Sakura, Tim, and Raina for supporting me during my days as a TO. Thanks to EVERYONE in general for their genuine support of my tournaments.

I will be locking this topic for now, before it gets too out of hand.

Until we meet again, stay gold.